Passover and Easter - Page 2

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Re:holiday card issue

Author: scott  Date:   04-16-03 11:04 I have been reading these posts and find them very interesting. The issue of to whom to sned what holiday cards would seem to be a simple one, I never realized it was so complex an issue. I view it like this. If you know somebody is Jewish, you send that person Jewish cards on Jewish holidays. If you know someone is Christian, you send Christian cards on Christmas. Jews do not send non-Jews cards on Jewish holidays. Why should they? The cards would not have any meaning to the recipient. Many, though not all Christians on the other hand will frequently send non-Jews Christmas cards, and sometimes even Easter cards. Christmas is such a secularized holiday in this country,(for better or for worse) that many Christians just don't see the conflict of interest in sending a Jew a Christmas card. Others send it for purely religious reasons, the 'spreading the gospel' kind of reasons, but by-and-large, it is the secularization of the holiday that leads many to send Jews Christmas cards. Most don't even give it a second thought. I personally get annoyed with people who know I'm Jewish and still send Christmas cards. However, I realize that they probalby don't know any better, and I usually end up pitching the card a few days later anyway. A Christmas card has no meaning for me, because for me December 25th is just another day, nothing special. I say that not in a mean way, just as a matter of fact.

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Re:

Author: (anonymous, for now)  Date:   04-17-03 12:17 I guess I just feel special when I get a card because it means the sender was thinking about me at a time when they felt inspired to think about me - be it because it's my birthday, because it's my holiday, because it's their holiday, because it's a Hallmark Holiday, or because they saw something that made them think of me and dropped me a note to say so. Obviously your experience is different than mine in that I've never used or heard of cards being used for most of the Jewish holidays, and you have and it's in fact a big deal to you to send out a card with the right label for everything and to receive a card with the right label for eveyrthing too. Not being familar with any customs involving Passover greeting cards, that's why I thought asking your relatives to use a "non-easter" card made more sense than asking them to use a "Passover" card, and similarly "Hannukah" cards, "Sukkot" cards, etc. I just feel like it oughtn't be a tit for tat thing where each Christian holiday needs a matching Jewish holiday to replace it and it should be celebrated the same way. My religion as I celebrate it isn't about cards at all; cards are about people and thoughts and i welcome any kinds of good thoughts from any people about anything. What about "we're thinking of you as we celebrate easter; we hope you had/will have a happy passover" as a note in a plain spring flowered card? Would that work for you? to me, that would feel special. And I feel perfectly special when we get a christmas card with a picture of baby Jesus on it from my fiance's family, too. Why? Because I'm in their thoughts at a time that's happy for them, and that me being in their thoughts is part of what makes them happy. That's how I read a card, I guess, just as saying that I'm in their thoughts. But that's just me. Most importantly, though, is that what will make your kids feel special or not special about a card is probably how *you* react to the card. If you're wincing and cursing under your breath and explaining all this stuff about how it's an imposition to have gotten a card that says Easter on it, they'll pick up bad feelings, and if not, I bet they'll say "neat, there's a bunny on the card" and not think twice about it. If you want your kids to feel good about your relatives having sent them a card, any card, you have to come up with some way that you can feel good about it, whether that's asking them to send passover cards, spring cards, or stressing less about the easter cards - whatever works for you. In any case, convey something honest and positive to your kids about the cards, or else you're right, it won't feel good to get a card that they can tell makes mommy grumpy. seems like you're putting a lot of weight on the easter card saying that the relatives don't love your kids as is and only love them by falsely imagining they're part Christians. maybe you should talk to them about better ways of accepting and loving your kids as they are, including their Jewish religion.

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Re: Rabbi Raphael's article on Interfaith Readings for your seder

Author: Ronnie Friedland, Editor  Date:   04-18-03 12:03 Dear Readers of InterfaithFamily.com, We are wondering if any of you incorporated Rabbi Raphael's interfaith family readings ( http://interfaithfamily.com/article/issue106/raphael.phtml) into your seders, and if so, whether people enjoyed them? Please add your reactions to this forum. Thanks, Ronnie Friedland, Editor

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Re: Welcome to our discussions!

Author: tom  Date:   04-18-03 15:36 I want to thank Interfaithfamily.com for having provided content for our seder. We added an artichoke on the seder plate, explained it, and read several paragraphs about Jewish thorniness and the sweetness of welcoming new viewpoints into our evening and lives. Our seder consisted of 5 Jews and 4 non-Jews. The interfaithfamily.com readings were especially well received by both Jews and non-Jews, and they set the mood for a very successful evening. Thank you interfaithfamily.com Tom Berkeley, CA

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Re: Seder

Author: Sarah Kraut  Date:   04-22-03 08:22 I was intermarried and am now divorced. We incorporated the artichoke reading into our seder as a way to honor my children. While our guests at the seder were all Jewish, they welcomed this new tradition and appreciated its show of respect for what others could bring to the Jewish people.

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Re: Easter cards

Author: Beth  Date:   04-22-03 20:17 Hope, So far, things have been going well with my in-laws. Last year when my husband and I sat down and talked to his parents, one of the things we discussed was them possibly coming over to our house and joining in some of our family celebrations. They seemed very positive about the whole idea. We thought this might help them feel a little more connected to this part of our daughters life. We had them over on the 2nd night of Chanukah this year and we all had a great time. They were very happy and appreciative that they could share in our holiday. My mother in law said that she thought it was going to be very important as our daughter grows up that they participate in these things. As far as cards go...they gave her a Chanukah card and Passover card this year. So, they really are trying! Also, the first year our daughter was born, his aunt gave her a Mrs. Santa Claus doll for Chanukah. This year when we saw her at my in-laws at Easter, she gave our daughter two Passover books. We were really touched. On this issue of sending and receiving cards, I too am flabbergasted by this idea that you would send a card based on the givers holiday. Isn't the whole idea behind sending a card to wish the recipient good wishes on THEIR holiday? If a person doesn't celebrate Easter, why would you send them an Easter card? I find that to be insensitive. I think card sending is ALL about the label attached to the card. When you walk into a card store, it's all about the labels...birthday, anniversary, congratulations, Chanukah, Christmas, get well, etc....and then it is broken down even further...husband birthday, wife birthday, mother birthday, etc... The whole poing is too get the most appropriate card for the occasion of the recipient. By the way, my family too, has always sent cards for many of the Jewish holidays...Chanukah, Rosh Hashana, Passover, and we send Purim baskets to our Jewish family and friends. Growing up sending cards was very important to my parents. My dad has a few Irish friends and every year he sends them a St. Patrick's Day card. He sends one to them because he knows that they are very proud of their Irish heritage and knows it would make them feel good to receive a card that reflects who they are. To my family, cards are always about the recipient. The nice thing about this forum is that is helps people to see that they are not alone. Reading your post was nice for me, because you articulated a lot of the same feelings I have had on this issue. However, obviously, not everyone is going to feel the same on this topic. That does not mean that you should feel compelled to keep quiet in fear that people will think that you are "grumpy" by expressing your feelings. You have every right to your feelings (they certainly make sense to me!) and I don't think you should keep them to yourself in order to spare others feelings. There has to be a way to express these feelings with tact, so that you are making your wishes known without insulting anyone. To successfully be in an interfaith family, I think you have to communicate with each other. You and your husbands family are coming at this from totally different perspectives. It is only right for them to listen to your perspective, and be respectful of your feelings. On the flip side, maybe there is some way you can also listen to their feelings and see if there is some way that some compromises can be made, so that some of their needs can be met as well. Ultimately, you and your husband are the parents and have the right to make these decisions. They may not agree with your decisions, but as I think I said above, they should be respectful of your wishes as the parent.

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Re: Easter cards, etc

Author: Hope  Date:   04-23-03 13:40 We were so busy with holidays this was my first chance to be online and catch up with the board. Thank you Scott for reinforcing my view of reality! Beth, I have to give you a special thanks because your letter feels so supportive. I think we are very much in a similar situation, raising Jewish children in an interfaith marriage. We attended a community seder on the second might, and my husband ended up sitting next to a reporter. It was so interesting and amazing to hear him explain to the reporter how we are raising our children. He talked about his comfort and ability to relate to Jewish concepts such as mitzvot and the ways I make the holidays child friendly and accessable for all the family to enjoy. It was so sweet and wonderful. I love the idea of involving the in-laws in your family holidays. I had tried some of that in the beginning and they did not come. But I haven't been extending the invitations since, and after reading your experiences feel reinvigorated to try again. And to anonymous, I appreciate the time you are taking to respond. I think it is different for me in a way you don't understand because I do have children. By the way I don't curse in front of my children, but they are learning what their holidays are, and they will recognize more and more the cards sent for them are not for their holidays. As a parent I want my children to feel good and accepted for who they are, which is why I feel the obligation to advocate on their behalf, wanting their relatives to honor their holidays. "Neat, there's a bunny on your card" doesn't seem to be an appropriate solution for raising Jewish children. Imagine how much more sweet it would be for them to receive the appropriate holiday card with symbols they are growing to recognize as their own, not just this year, but in the years to come as well. In the same way I give my Christian relatives the best and coolest presents and cards for Christmas I can find, so I can share their joy in their holiday, and they know Aunt Hope recognizes and appreciates them for who they are. It seems to me one of the biggest challenges for interfaith parents is getting others to accept and respect the decisions they have made for their children. It is the parents' perogative and right to make such decisions, but sometimes it seems difficult to get others to recognize that it's not up for a village vote. I think that's why it felt so amazing and wonderful to hear my husband talking about his views about raising Jewish children. No matter what the outside level of support this works really well for us, and feels good. That's why I'm also thankful for the messages of support on this board that help me keep a positive focus. And now I'm super thankful for new friends we have made who actually sent my daughters Passover cards with frog stickers!!! I have a whole new appreciation for just how thoughtful they are.

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Re: hope-recent message

Author: scott  Date:   04-25-03 10:34 Hope, I have been reading some of you comments on this web site, you certainly seem to put a lot of time into them. They have been interesting. One of the comments you wrote indicated that you found it very challenging raising your famliy the way you are, that the challenge wasn't so much in raising the family (that's a challenge for anyone) but in getting people to accept your choices. You are raising your kids Jewish, which I think is good. Does the "village" you refer to respect this? Do you get more flack from the Jewish side or non Jewish side of the family? I have talked to people who while intermarried, and raise their kids Jewish, actually get more flack from the Jewish side- about raising their children as Jews. Has the same thing happened with you?

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Re: Scott's message

Author: Hope  Date:   04-28-03 15:18 Hi Scott, Thanks for enjoying my messages! One of the surprises I had, after growing up in a conservative/orthodox synagogue, was that the Jewish community has been very supportive of us. I didn't necessarily expect that, and I have heard some real negative stories from people about their experiences trying to bring a non-Jewish spouse into a synagogue. We belong to a small, reconstructionist synagogue. The Rabbi was totally comfortable with marrying us, and we had a meaningful and memorable ceremony. At first it was a little wierd for us to be in such a small congregation. Our initial visits people seemed to line up to ask us who we are and where we are from. Recently though my husband commented how nice it was to walk in the seder and know just about everyone, and how comfortable that is now. My family had no problem with this, there are a lot of mixed marriages in my family, I think I was the 6th grandchild to intermarry so by then it was no big shock to any of the older relatives. And I got married late so everyone was just relieved! My husband's family had (have) a very difficult time with it. Also people who are aquaintances and new friends don't always seem comfortable with it. They will find out he is Catholic and want to know if he is converting (one of the first questions his family asked) and the answer is "no." Then they want to know how it is we will raise our kids without them knowing who they really are, or ignoring half their heritage. We usually explain religion is not the same as race. We are not ignoring or pretending for instance that they aren't of Hispanic heritage, but we do feel you can only be one religion. This was a relatively easy discussion for us before marriage and an easy decision to carry through with. Some relatives have opted out of our lives in protest of our decision. We received word that one was very ill and decided to pay a visit to them in the hospital, I really believed that in that kind of situation a person would know what was really important in life. Instead we spent our time there defending our decision not to have a Christmas tree. I'm sad to think anyone would choose that path, and feel sorry that in a way I have brought pain to my husband, and feel angry too that anyone would introduce my children to that kind of pain (even if they aren't aware of it yet) but there's only so much you can control. If we had the Interfaith Guide to Family Lfe before our marriage we would have done a better job of breaking the news to his family but that may not have helped us!

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Re: hope

Author: scotty  Date:   04-29-03 12:30 Thank you for your reply. It's interesting that most of the flack you got came from the non-Jewish side of your family. Of course, from your description, intermarriage has been common in your family, so I guess it would be logical not to expect so much flack from them. Its unfortunate that some of your family have 'cut you off'. That I think is not an appropriate way to deal with it. You're trying to raise you children Jewish I see. I hope it's not too personal, and if it is, you don't have to answer, I'll undersatnd, but how will you feel if your children marry a non-Jew? I assume you would be okay with it? What if your child leaves the religion all together? Scott.

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Re: Scott's message

Author: Hope  Date:   05-06-03 13:09 Hi again Scott, Such tough questions!!! I would be OK with my daughters marrying outside the faith. People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones you know ;-) I would prefer for them to live Jewish lives, but when they become adults they, like all of us, have the ultimate responsibility for figuring out the world, their beliefs and what they consider the best course for their souls. Admittedly, if they both left the faith I would be disappointed. Plus someone will need to take over the Seder hosting by then! I'm already overburdened with Jewish holiday hosting. Take Care Hope

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Re: interfaith Seder

Author: Mel  Date:   03-13-04 15:17 My son is married to a Catholic girl. She still maintains her faith. MY son invites her mother and two brothers to his seder. I feel uncomfortable celebrating Passover with non-Jews. I am considering not attending, but don't want cause any ill-will in his family. I could use some feed-back. Regards, Mel

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Re: Mel's post

Author: BobP  Date:   03-14-04 11:53 <<... I feel uncomfortable celebrating Passover with non-Jews...>> <<... don't want (to) cause any ill-will in his family...>> If you attend a seder with your son and his wife (without her family there), then there is already at least one non-Jew. I believe one part of the seder says something like "let all who are hungry come and eat". It doesn't say all JEWS who are hungry. I can't think of a way that would be more dis-respectful than for you to not attend because his in-laws are there. This is about what Jews believe, and is a great opportunity to share the traditions and rituals. Go and enjoy your family. Bob

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Re: interfaith Seder

Author: Ellen  Date:   03-14-04 23:57 Um, Mel? Are you willing to attend a seder with her there? For that matter, were you willing to attend their wedding? I'm presuming here that the answer to both questions is "yes." So how is it any different or any more difficult for you to attend a seder with her family present? If you don't attend, how many other Jews will there be? Would your son be the only Jewish person there? How would you feel about leaving him in that position?

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Passover question

Author: Martha  Date:   03-15-04 10:11 Hello: I will not be able to join my boyfriend's family for passover. They are not hosting a formal sedder in their home, but they will have an informal family seder (for lack of a better term) in their home on one of the 2 nights. Is it costumary to send something, like a card, a bouquet of flowers, or a food or wine basket (keeping in mid, of course, that any food sent should be kosher) I cannot attend because of work reasons, but I do not want to seem disrepectful of such an important holiday in the eyes of my boyfriend's family by not even sending some type of acknowledgement of the holiday. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

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i dont understand

Author: charlotte hubbard  Date:   03-23-04 17:07 Ok. I have a school project to do tomorrow and I have to do this on the similarities on Passover and Easter and i have looked at a few websites but the really dont help me. Well i was wondering if someone else could help me out on this. It would be very highly appreciated if someone could. Well thank you alot I hope someone can help me. signed confused

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Re: Charlotte

Author: BobP  Date:   03-23-04 20:05 Other than the fact that Easter is supposed to have occurred at Passover (ie the last supper was a Passover seder), I don't know what the similarities would be. Easter celebrates the resurection of Jesus for Christians; there is no similar holiday in Judaism. Passover celebrates the freedom from slavery in Egypt. PS. You never know the correctness of replies to a question you post online. I suggest you do your own research.

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Re: charlotte

Author: Scott  Date:   03-28-04 16:53 Charlotte, Passover and easter have very few similarities. There are those who say that the last supper was in fact a seder. But, in reality, the fact is, that it probably was not. The seder meal, while no one uis ure iof its exact date of origin, is beleieved to have deleoped around the late first centruy c.e. (c.e=a.d.), after the Jewish Temple had been destoryed by the romans. Prior to that time, Passover was one of the 3 pilgrimage festivals, durring which masses of Jews came to Jeruslaem to offer the paschal sacrifice at the Temple in Jerusalem. CHristians today beleive that Jesus' death was a sacrifice. This has nothing though to do with passover, though. People often point to the fact that Jesus' crucifixion was right around the time that passover occured that year, and associate it with passover, because of the idea of sacrifice. The holidays couldnt be more different, actually. Easter is the aniversiarry of a mans death. Passover has nothing to do with that death, or any death for that matter. About the only thing concretely similar is that the two holidays are in the springtime.

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Re: Interfaith Passover

Author: Margarita  Date:   03-29-04 09:36 Dear CD, I would suggest going to your local synagogue during office hours. Most synagogues have a gift shop and at this time of year carry a variety of Haggadah. Read through some of them. Many contemporary Haggadot now include sections on the liberation of peoples other than Jews, such as African Americans, women, etc. and connects how God liberated us, the Jews, with how God continues to liberate all who live enslaved. If you have a women's bookstore near you, or go online, you may find a feminist haggadah which does this very well.

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Re: sending flowers/food

Author: Poppet  Date:   04-12-04 01:06 Martha: Sorry - I didn't see this thread before, or I would've replied earlier. Yes, it would be lovely to send flowers or food (chocolates, etc) as long as it's kosher for Passover. Prob. best to send parve (non-dairy) if you're going to send chocolate (so they can be enjoyed after a meat meal). I guess this message is a little late, but I think even a nice letter saying "sorry I couldn't make it, hope you had good Pesach (Passover)" would be thoughtful. Passover ends tomorrow night, so if you wanted to, you could still call them - even to ackowledge that the holiday ends (because people celebrate/observe the last two days too). I would hazard to say that except for Yom Kippur, kosher food/flowers are a thoughtful gift for any of the major holidays (Rosh Hashana, Sukkot, Shavuot, Passover, Chanuka). (Any thoughts anyone?) Lastly, if you're ever unsure in future - and need faster answers, I'd suggest calling whatever local rabbi or Jewish organization suits you (Chabad Lubavitch/Aish HaTorah/ etc.) - or even faster, call your local Judaica store - they should be happy to help, and will prob. have good suggestions. Best, P. (conservative-ish Jew)

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taking Jewish grandchildren to church

Author: Dena Silver  Date:   11-21-04 20:26 I would like to disagree with Dr. Paula Brody's answer to the writer of: "Dear Dr. Paula: Can I Take My Jewish Grandchildren to Church with Me this Easter?" I respectfully disagree with Dr. Paula's advise to the Christian grandparents to take their grandchildren, who are being raised Jewish, to church on Easter. Absolutely not--unless the parents give permission--beforehand! Why does the grandmother ask the question? Does she not know to respect her daughter's decision to raise the children Jewish? On the other hand: why are the parents leaving their Jewish children with their Christian grandparents on such a cherished time as Easter weekend? Is that a passive-aggressive way to disrespect the Christian grandparents? Is that a passive-aggressive way for one spouse to undermine the other spouse's desire to raise the children Jewish? This was a very complicated article!

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Celebrating both religious holidays

Author: Edith  Date:   12-25-04 14:41 In your opinions - should Jewish children celebrate both Christian and Jewish holidays? Should they celebrate with Chanukah with presents with their Jewish side of the family, and then celebrate Christmas with their Christian side? Both events complete with gift giving, holiday dinners, etc? How to begin separting it? thanks

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Re: passover cards and gifts

Author: milly  Date:   01-19-05 13:38 im doing passover in class and is there any gifts or cards that they send to each other during this peroid of time

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Re: passover cards and gifts

Author: Rosie  Date:   01-20-05 10:37 Milly, Passover gifts are more common in Israel than in the U.S. I believe that it is a custom there for employers to give their workers a Passover bonus. In our family, we have given our own children small gifts or new toys on the first night of Passover. Originally, it was a prize to the child who found the Afikomen (matzah hidden at the beginning of the service to be eaten at the end of the meal). From a purely practical sense, it is a good time to present young children with a new toy because it will be nice and clean for the holiday (cleanliness is especially important at Passover -- see one of the websites below), and it keeps them amused while the grown-ups are sitting around the table all evening arguing about philosophy and politics. Beyond that, sending gifts and cards is not really a Jewish holiday tradition. We send out cards at Rosh Hashanah, and that is it. Anything else is just an invention of the greeting card industry or a wish to be more like the non-Jewish neighbors. Of course, if you have Jewish friends (or friends of other religions) it is courteous to wish them happiness on the holidays they are celebrating, whether by letter, card, or phone or face to face. If you want to know more about how Jewish people celebrate Passover and other holidays, go to these sites: http://www.jewfaq.org/holidaya.htm http://www.jewfaq.org/holidayg.htm http://www.aish.com/holidays/passover/default.asp

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